Jonny Gould Interviews: Peter Withe Part 4 (of 4)

Here's the concluding part of the Peter Withe Story in which he covers his highly successful coaching career in the Far East, never afraid to take on and complete a faraway football mission.

And he answers this: who was the greatest coach he played for, Ron Saunders or Brian Clough!

As a Villa fan, I'd love your feedback, so drop me a line below and thanks for watching.

Please share if you like the video. Many thanks!

Jonny Gould Interviews: Peter Withe Part 2 (of 4)

Here's the part 2 of our four-part series chronicling the remarkable career of Peter Withe. In this episode, Peter discusses his departure from Nottingham Forest, soon after winning the League and League Cup, his move to Newcastle - and the background to his Aston Villa transfer, which saw him scale the heights of European football.


Part 1 is available here

This is a Sportsmedia co-production with John Warrington. Peter's life story written with Simon Goodyear is out now.

Play-offs would've stopped English football's greatest story

I overheard a conversation about Nottingham Forest last night. A casual observer asked if Forest had finished third in this season's Championship, why Blackpool, three places and nine points behind them would be in the Premier League instead of them next season?

The Tangerines, who on the last day of the season clinched the final playoff place, beat two teams in a knockout competition at the end of a rigorous campaign. Basically, Blackpool came into form at the right time as Forest got tired. The team who finish sixth often win promotion. When it was explained to the observer why the playoffs existed, "money" was the predictable, but truthful answer given.

Which reminds me. In 1977, Forest also secured third place in the same division to claim their place among the elite. There were no playoffs then. The rest, as they say, is history.

What came next was one of the most extraordinary ascents to the game's summit ever seen.

Brian Clough's men stormed all before them: signing Peter Shilton and Kenny Burns in the close-season, Forest went on to complete an astonishing League Championship and League Cup double followed by a successful defence of the League Cup and the first of two successive European Cups. Trevor Francis became the first million pound player and journeymen like John Robertson, Archie Gemmill and Tony Woodcock became football's biggest stars.

I'm not saying Billy Davies' charges would have done the same thing had they been promoted, but it's highly questionable if the extraordinary events would've unfolded for Cloughie's men had they been forced to play three more games at the end of a tough campaign, and just to earn the promotion they'd already won on merit.

There aren't relegation playoffs anymore as defeat for the vanquished is too painful, the drama too acute. Remember the riots at the Chelsea v Middlesbrough game at Stamford Bridge all those years ago? The conventional wisdom is that playoffs should be about a positive prize - promotion to the higher league. And that tired metaphor about the Premier League's Promised Land.

But given the history of Nottingham Forest, I am not sure about the play-offs at all.

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Good Players Don't Always Make Good Managers

By MARCUS STEAD

Some years ago, Brian Clough gave an interview to the BBC’s Garry Richardson, in which he said, “You’re a good interviewer... you might even be the best. But if I put you behind that camera, you probably wouldn’t know where to start.”

Cloughie made an important point, and it’s one for which every Premier League chairman should take heed (and a few broadcasting executives, but Jonny’s already written about that!)

A person’s ability as a player proves absolutely nothing about their suitability to manage a big club. Sir Bobby Charlton wasn’t cut out for management, and there are plenty of other world-class players who haven’t made the grade once they’ve hung up their boots.

When Mark Hughes was appointed Wales’s manager, I was among those who felt putting someone with no managerial experience in such a big position was like taking a gamble that would put even Mike Ashley to shame.

We knew absolutely nothing about whether he was cut out for management, and to this day, I think my fears were justified. No Wales fan will ever forget that day in late 2002 when we beat Italy at the Millennium Stadium. But before and after that famous victory, there was some absolute dross from the team, and his win ratio was less than 30%.

In club management, he got Blackburn playing some decent football, and Manchester City have looked reasonable on occasions since he took over, but the fact remains he hasn’t got a single significant achievement to his name nearly a decade after he started at Wales.

There have been a number of ex-players who were given their first crack at management at the highest level, only for it to end in disaster, but so many Premier League chairmen don’t seem to be getting the message.

On the other side of the coin, some pretty unremarkable players turn out to be world-class managers. Okay, so Sir Alex played at a high level in Scotland, but can anyone tell me anything (without cheating) about the playing records of Arsene Wenger, Rafael Benitez or Jose Mourinho? All three retired very early from playing, served their apprenticeships and took low-level jobs in management.

To give an English example, Roy Hodgson played very little first-team football, yet he commands an enormous amount of respect as a manager, and will no doubt build on his success at Fulham.

This is exactly my point. Aside from being an ex-sportsman who fancies a career in the media, can anybody think of any other walk of life where you can take your first job at the very top of your chosen profession?

In normal life, you are either expected to gain some sort of qualification, or start at the bottom of the ladder and work your way up. Why should football management be any different? Premier League chairmen should realise there are plenty of promising young managers in the lower leagues who deserve the opportunity to prove themselves at a higher level. Most weren’t big names as players, but have made the best of the limited resources they’ve been given to work with. These people deserve a chance of working with limited resources in the big league.

Giving a managerial novice a job in the Premier League isn’t fair on him either, no matter how good he was as a player. Gareth Southgate has learnt his trade in the full glare of the national media, with his every mistake scrutinised in front of the whole country. He may yet prove to be a good manager, but surely it would have been better for him to learn the ropes at a smaller club, where only a few thousand diehard supporters would be on his back.

So things didn’t work out for Paul Ince at Blackburn, but that doesn’t make him a bad manager. Maybe he needed more time. Another person who has followed the “proper route” and has genuinely earned the right to manage a relatively big club is Nigel Clough. Don’t get me wrong, I very much doubt the thought of appointing the current manager of Burton Albion would’ve occurred to anyone on the board at Derby had it not been for his father’s legacy.

That’s not to say Clough Jnr doesn’t fully deserve a crack at the (fairly) big-time. He has already led Burton to one promotion and would probably have got them into the Football League if he’d stayed put.

There’s a chance his father’s remarkable achievements at Derby all those years ago may hang like a noose around his neck, and the weight of expectation could prove too high. But a far more likely scenario is that he’ll adopt similar principles to those he applied successfully at Burton and lead Derby back into the Premier League within a few seasons.

It’s a pity many others with managerial CV’s similar to his aren’t given a chance.

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Keano: from hottest prospect to journeyman inside twelve months

Roy Keane's Ipswich Town stare up at the rest after yet another defeat, 2-1 at Barnsley.

Rock bottom of the Championship: five points from safety, no league wins eleven games into the season, the board at Portman Road's jittery. A statement offering Keane their full support must be being prepared. The fans of this once-proud club will wonder if the days of Sir Alf Ramsey, Bobby Robson, Arnold Muhren and the Premier League will ever return.

Can we believe this is a team run by Keane? the fearless Irish skipper who seemingly took to management like a duck to water? the selfless Manchester United talisman who steered Sunderland from twenty-third place to the Championship earning promotion to the Premier League? the maturing realist who harnessed his big reputation and experience to attract good players to the Stadium of Light?

What's happened to Keane? the hottest managerial prospect - to Championship journeyman inside twelve months. And we thought the demise of Leeds United was fast.

Clues to his downfall are in the tabloid headlines of yesteryear. To my mind, his walkout as Black Cats boss was akin to Kevin Keegan's tantrum-sponsored resignations. Keano quit because he was in a bad mood for a fortnight.

Describing a narrow victory League Cup victory over Northampton as one of his "worst and longest nights", branding the FIFA Vice-President Jack Warner "a clown" in a row over Dwight Yorke's withdrawal from the Trinidad & Tobago squad and rambling about his future in a post-match interview at Bolton, Keane walked out on his players leaving the club in the relegation zone.

Ipswich would have gone into this appointment with their eyes open - but they only thought of the upside. He's a big name, with a fine playing pedigree, a decent start to his managerial record at the Stadium of Light, a pupil of Brian Clough and Sir Alex Ferguson with an absolute no-compromise attitude to winning.

But he's also the Alfe-Inge Haaland career-ender, the Mick McCarthy disrespector and a man who gets out of the kitchen when he can't stand the heat.

Even fifteen months ago, Keane was talked of as a future Manchester United boss. Not now. When asked, Sir Alex Ferguson's evasive comments about Keane's managerial prospects were withering.

"Young managers come along and people say this one will be England manager or boss of this club, but two years later they're not there. It's not an easy environment to come into, I wouldn't forecast anything."

Keane's greatest moment came in a courageous semi-final appearance in the Champions League at Juventus in 1999. Knowing he was suspended for the Final, he still stood like a man mountain against the Turin side and scored a vital goal to earn United's place in the Final. Maybe, just maybe, his time will come again.

This won't be his last job in the game and indeed if the circumstances are right, you couldn't write Keano off from winning a piece of silverware with a compliant board and adoring fans as a backdrop.

But he'd make a better Shock Jock or Studio Pundit. Keane's managerial career is definitely on a yellow. 

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Dynamo Kiev's Death Match

By JAMES-GUY JACOBS.

Football doesn't tend to translate well onto the big screen. There have been several ineffective attempts to do so ranging from The Arsenal Stadium Mystery (1939) to the laughable Mean Machine (2001), starring Vinnie Jones.

A widely anticipated exception to this rule is The Damned United from 2009. This stars the consumate actor, Michael Sheen who played David Frost in Frost/Nixon and Tony Blair in The Queen (2006). It relates the tale of Brian Clough's 44 day reign as manager of Leeds United in 1974 and is based on David Peace's seminal novel of the same name.

Perhaps the most remarkable football film ever made was Escape to Victory (1981). This featured a highly unlikely cast including Michael Caine, Sylvester Stallone, Pele, Bobby Moore and Ossie "Tottingham" Ardiles. The plot of the film seemed equally implausible.

It went as follows: In World War II, a group of Nazi officers devise a propaganda event in which an all star Nazi team play a team composed of Allied Prisoners of War in a football game. The Prisoners agree, beat the Nazis against all the odds and then use the game as a means of escape from the camp.

Pure nonsense, right?

Wrong. The story was actually based on one of the most extraordinary football matches of all time and was comprehensively detailed in Andy Dougan's compelling book (Amazon): Dynamo: Triumph and Tragedy in Nazi-Occupied Kiev

To learn about what actually happened, we need to travel back to the Soviet Union in the late 1930s.

In this era and location, football started to become very popular, especially in Ukraine. The region's strongest team of this time was Dynamo Kyiv, part of the Dynamo sports society that was funded by the trade unions, the police and the Red Army. In Soviet Russia, football was a state-sponsored activity.

In 1938, Dynamo Kyiv came fourth in the national league, scoring seventy-six goals, but then performed poorly in 1939 and 1940.

The 1941 season was never completed, as Germany invaded the Soviet Union on 22 June 1941. Several Dynamo Kyiv players joined the military and went off to fight. As the Germans approached Kiev, the others who had stayed behind helped out with civil defence in the city. The initial success of the German Army allowed it to capture Kiev, one of the Soviet Union's major cities, from the Red Army. Several of the Dynamo Kyiv players who had survived the onslaught then found themselves prisoners of war in concentration camps.

In 1942, Dynamo's keeper, Mykola Trusevych, returned to the city and began searching all over Kiev for his former team mates. Over several traumatic weeks, he was able to form a new club, F C Start, which comprised of eight players from Dynamo and three players from Lokomotiv Kiev. During 1942, FC Start played several matches with teams of soldiers of occupying garrisons, and won them all.

However, this was not entirely positive. The German administration grew aware that FC Start victories might inspire Ukrainian inhabitants and decrease the morale of Axis troops.

Consequently, the German Luftwaffe team, Flakelf, set up a match with F C Start on 9 August, 1942 at Zenit stadium. An SS officer was appointed as referee, and FC Start were aware that he would be biased against them. Although anonymous sources warned FC Start of severe punishment if they did not lose the game to the Germans, the team still decided to play as always. They also refused to give a Nazi salute to their opponents before the match.

Just as the the FC Start players expected, the Nazi referee ignored Flakelf fouls. The German team quickly targeted the goalkeeper, Trusevych who, after a sustained campaign of physical challenges, was kicked in the head by a Flakelf forward and left groggy. While Trusevych was recovering, Flakelf went one goal up.

The referee continued to ignore FC Start appeals against their opponents' violence. The Flakelf team went on with their war of intimidation using every dirty tactic in the book. Despite this, FC Start scored with a long shot from a free kick by the former Dynamo striker, Ivan Kuzmenko. Then, the former Dynamo winger, Makar Honcharenko, against the run of play, dribbled the ball around almost the entire Flakelf defence and tapped it into in the German net to make the score 2-1.

By half-time, FC Start had scored another goal. Each side then scored twice in the second half. Towards the end of the match, with FC Start in an almost unbeatable position at 5-3, Oleksiy Klimenko, a defender, got the ball, beat the entire German rearguard and walked around the German goalkeeper. Then, instead of letting it cross the goal line, he turned around and kicked the ball back towards the centre circle. At this point, the SS referee blew the final whistle before the 90 minutes were up.

The consequences were dire for the F C Start side. Shortly after the match, all the players were arrested and accused of being Soviet spies. They were tortured and either executed immediately or sent to harsh labour camps. Only three of the eleven survived the war and were responsible for the popularisation of the story in Soviet culture.

The match itself was later branded "The Death Match" and inspired both Soviet and Hungarian cinematic tributes, as well Ossie, Sly and Sir Michael's 1981 effort. Now not alot of people know that!

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Also on the Soccermongery: Nil-Nil Jeff! you're guide to Football on TV and Fergie's News Conferences are better than some of the games and Today's Top Story.

The Clough name lives on at Derby

By JOE MORRIS (making his Soccermongery debut). Joe takes a look at the Cloughs, their bond with each other - and Derby.

The relationship between father and son is always a special one, but for Nigel Clough the bond with his dad, Brian, could never be broken. Father and son were never less than best friends and you somehow knew that one day Nigel would do exactly; the same job as his doting dad.

Earlier this month, Nigel Clough became the new manager of Derby County, 42 years after Ol' Big 'Ead breezed into the old Baseball Ground. In 1967 Clough senior was an unknown, Derby were struggling at the wrong end of the old Second Division and a band from Liverpool were conquering the world.

After serving a stern 10-year apprenticeship at non-league Burton Albion, a boy called Nigel has been catapulted into the deep end at Championship club Derby County. Which is roughly where Clough senior came in. By the end of Brian Clough's career both Derby County and Nottingham Forest had become household names with trophies galore.

Brian Clough won League championships in abundance with both Derby and Forest, boasting one of the most identifiable of voices. He was forthright, opinionated, an infuriating nuisance at times but always accessible to both the public and media alike. He once called an eccentric Polish goalkeeper a clown, hollered obscenities at his players when close season training wasn't going according to plan, and in a League Cup match against QPR, lashed out at Rangers supporters.

In their Carling Cup semi-final against Manchester United last week, Nigel Clough sat quietly in the Directors Box remembering the good times with dad. In contrast to his controversial father, Nigel, it would seem, is an altogether different footballing boss. It remains to be seen whether Nigel will tell his players exactly what he thinks of them and whether cups and saucers are thrown in the dressing room.

Clough junior, apart from bearing an uncanny resemblance to Ol' Big 'Ead, is also a devoted family man. He will set out his footballing theories, put a sympathetic hug around his players when things go pear-shaped and then undoubtedly demand three points and the Champions League trophy

When he was at Burton Albion all Clough had to deal with was a postage stamp sized ground, little or no money for new players and the electricity bills. Non-league clubs are the poor relations in football's great pyramid, so when he takes his place for his first match as Derby boss the culture shock may just startle him.

He will climb into the Pride Park dug out, take in the glamorous surroundings and wonder what he's letting himself for. In the old days Derby's Baseball Ground would often resemble a gravel pit. Brian Clough would walk out on the pitch, politely applaud his adoring supporters and then watch his much revered side including John McGovern, Archie Gemmell, Kevin Hector and John O'Hare.

The task that faces son Nigel is entirely different and this time there are no European cups or League Championships on the immediate horizon. There is no Peter Taylor to confide in when the boys are under-achieving, only a reliable back room staff to hand out reassurance.

When Nigel the younger was growing up, dad Brian would often take him to to all the matches. You can still see the little boy in shorts sitting excitedly next to his dad and just smiling. True Brian Clough was a master motormouth, tactlessness personified and a man with no regard for the niceties. But he taught his players all of the game's finer virtues and he also encouraged them to treat the ball like a favourite uncle.

If Nigel Clough can make half the same impact as his monumentally successful dad then Derby County could well be back in the big time in no time. During one League encounter against Manchester City, a groundsman had to run on to the pitch to paint a penalty spot.

From the resultant penalty Derby scored. Brian Clough would have seen the funny side of that one isolated incident. If Nigel Clough can keep looking at the bright side of life then Derby County could be grinning from ear to ear.

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Big 4 massive debt will produce change we can believe in!

Most of the Premier League's twenty clubs are up for sale - URGENTLY! Keith Harris, who's sold five top-flight clubs in his time admits to having two hopes of selling Everton:

No Hope and Bob Hope.

Toffees chairman Bill Kenwright instructed Harris of merchant bank, Seymour Pierce, to find new investors after admitting the club couldn't keep borrowing. They've yet to finance the new stadium at Kirkby.

Harris explained it's not a rich city and Everton's cause isn't helped by sharing it with Liverpool either. Which brought him onto Liverpool and the subject of this piece: Arsenal, Liverpool and Manchester United really do play in the red!

Harris is concerned that the Reds' huge £350million debt with two stricken banks Wachovia and RBS, are due for repayment in a few days. They've an option to renew for another six months - but time is running short for Liverpool owners Messrs. Hicks and Gillett, to transfer the debt from done-for banks to other super-rich individuals.

Manchester United are £two-thirds of a billion in debt, following the Glazer takeover although United is probably the most multi-layered football business in the world, so it should be okay. They've just got to keep winning!

Chelsea's debt is owed to Roman Abramovich and is interest-free, so they're either here to stay or will fall like a house of cards.

So as the swirling winds of economic turmoil threaten to blow the tops off football's leading houses, it's time for a lofty prediction!

Football's great believers and idealogues will start winning trophies at the expense of debt-laden monsters.

Who couldn't have been immensely impressed by Wenger's kids in the League Cup this season? And by the time they're 21-year-old first-teamers, Liverpool's debt will have been re-structured and some of their best players may have been sold off.

Arsenal with "only" £260million of debt, and that to pay for the Emirates (at 5% per annum) are well-poised to dominate - if they can keep patient with Wenger's average team right now.

That's "good debt" compared with the other big three. It's secured against the world's bigget matchday revenues, increased sponsorship opportunities and secondary rights sales. Looking good, Arsenal.

I take them to win the title either next season or definitely the year after. And once they do, they can dominate for a while.

Aston Villa can take advantage too. The very best chairman - supportive, committed, low-profile. A manager who's been there and done it, as both a player and a boss. Huge supporter-base. Non-controversial. Aston Villa have also done it before!

As football evolves from a debt-led orgy of win today to a more egalitarian lesser-leveraged future, football's great planners and dreamweavers will win the day.

We may never return to a period of such austerity that allowed Nottingham Forest to jump from 3rd in Division 2 to Champions of Europe in two years, but one thing is for sure, football men with football ideas will have more chance of producing winning teams without always being trumped by Big Spending Giants.

In the spirit of Brian Clough, the sport may be about to become much more competitive. As football fans, can we raise a glass to that? Yes We Can!

Soccermongery's all about your feedback, so write away, right away!

No takers for Everton. Liverpool in financial danger. The Premier League promises to look very different in the future.

Keith Harris, who's sold five Premier League clubs in his time admits to having two hopes of selling Everton:

No Hope and Bob Hope.

Everton chairman Bill Kenwright instructed Harris of merchant bank, Seymour Pierce, to find new investors after admitting the club couldn't keep borrowing. They've yet to finance the new stadium at Kirkby.

Harris explained it's not a rich city and Everton's cause isn't helped by sharing it with Liverpool either. Which brought him onto Liverpool and the subject of this piece: Arsenal, Liverpool and Manchester United really do play in the red!

Harris is concerned that the Reds' huge £350million debt with two stricken banks Wachovia and RBS, are due for repayment in January. They've an option to renew for another six months - but time is running short for Liverpool owners Messrs. Hicks and Gillett, to transfer the debt from done-for banks to other super-rich individuals.

Manchester United are £two-thirds of a billion in debt, following the Glazer takeover although United is probably the most multi-layered football business in the world, so it should be okay. They've just got to keep winning!

Chelsea's debt is owed to Roman Abramovich and is interest-free, so they're either here to stay or will fall like a house of cards.

So as the swirling winds of economic turmoil threaten to blow the tops off football's leading houses, it's time for a lofty prediction!

Football's great believers and idealogues will start winning trophies at the expense of debt-laden monsters.

Who couldn't have been immensely impressed by Wenger's kids mashing up all before them in the League Cup this season? And by the time they're 21-year-old first-teamers, Liverpool's debt will have been re-structured and some of their best players may have been sold off.

Arsenal with only £260million of debt, and that to pay for the Emirates (at 5% per annum) are so well-poised to dominate.

That's "good debt" compared with other big three. Huge matchday revenues, increased sponsorship opportunities and secondary rights sales. Looking good, Arsenal.

I take them to win the title either next season or definitely the year after! And once they do, they can dominate for a while.

Aston Villa can take advantage too. The very best chairman - supportive, committed, low-profile. A manager who's been there and done it, as both a player and a boss. Huge supporter-base. Non-controversial. Aston Villa have also done it before!

As football evolves from a debt-led orgy of win today to a more egalitarian lesser-leveraged future, football's great planners and dreamweavers will win the day.

We may never return to a period of such austerity that allowed Nottingham Forest to jump from 3rd in Division 2 to Champions of Europe in two years, but one thing is for sure, football men with football ideas will have more chance of producing winning teams without always being trumped by Big Spending Giants.

In the spirit of Brian Clough, the sport may be about to become much more competitive. As football fans, we can all raise a glass to that!